Tag Archive - Anne Jackson

Depression, Burnout & Ministry: Anne Jackson Interview, Part 2

January 29, 2009 in Ministry-Theology, Therapy-Psychology with 11 Comments

jacksona22This is Part 2 of my interview with author and blogger Anne Jackson.

Check out Part 1 here.

From your own perspective, what is at the root behind the stigma of counseling and therapy in the Church? What would you say to Christians who think that we should not take medications for depression and anxiety?

It has always been difficult for me to say I needed to be in counseling to the extent I was, or to say that I have been on a myriad of anti-depressants or anti-anxiety medicine because I’ve heard countless times people question my salvation or my authority to work out God’s calling in my life. Most people think that something is wrong with my spiritual walk if I have to use these “crutches.” I think that the people who are judgmental about these things live in a bubble that desperately needs to be popped. That means they have stayed safe and comfortable their whole life…and there is nothing about Christianity or redemption that is safe or comfortable.

What goes through your head when you hear Christians or church leaders tell people that they just need to pray more, or have more faith, or read their Bible more to overcome their depression and anxiety?

Honestly, I want to punch them. It makes me so angry (Yes, I have anger issues too!) ☺ There is a spiritual element to our emotional and mental health and we absolutely should practice those disciplines of our faith. But there is no magic pill to cure all. We are all uniquely designed and will each walk a different road for a different reason.

Continue Reading…

Depression, Burnout & Ministry: Anne Jackson Interview, Part 1

January 23, 2009 in Ministry-Theology, Therapy-Psychology with 13 Comments

Today I begin the first part of a two part interview I did with Anne Jackson.  I first heard about Anne around two years ago when one of my church jacksona22co-workers Matt Singley kept referring to some blogger named Flowerdust.  I was told that she was one of the most popular and influential bloggers on the internet.  Immediately intrigued I hopped onto her site and almost immediately felt a breath of fresh air as wrote with an authenticity, vulnerability and purpose that is sometimes hard to find–not only in blogging circles, but the “Christian” world.  Since that day Anne is one of my favorite daily reads and I  really appreciate her insight and passion that is obviously very contagious among her readership.

As you will see from the two-part interview, my main desire behind interviewing her was because of her often “lone voice” in the Christian blogging circles to openly talk about issues of depression, anxiety, mental health and medication.  I think her willingness to talk so openly about these things has resonated with many, many people as is witness by the tons of comments she receives on a daily basis.

51exizsjwkl_sl500_aa240_Oh, and lest I forget, she’s the author of the new book Mad Church Disease: Overcoming the Burnout Epidemic.

Anne, in a sentence or two, what was the impetus behind writing Mad Church Disease?

It was twenty seven years in the making…from watching my own parents burn out in ministry, to my own stress-induced hospital stay, I realized that left and right church leaders are being taken out – yet nobody is talking about it.  I hope this book will catalyze conversations about not only our brokenness, but our health.

As you address the issues of burnout and self-care I was wondering if you have seen a correlation between burnout or lack of self-care and depression?  Do you have any personal examples you could share?

Stress, when accumulated over time, can cause chemical changes in our bodies.  It increases bad hormones and decreases good ones.  As time goes on, these changes can lead to semi-permanent or permanent damage.

Over the two years I allowed the stress to run my life, I noticed how I went from feeling “stressed” to feeling hopeless and unmotivated.  At its worst, there were days when I didn’t even leave my bed.  Ashamed (and again, unmotivated), I withdrew from my relationships and my responsibilities.

Continue Reading…

How Do You Say No To Good Things?

November 18, 2008 in Ministry-Theology with 7 Comments

I came across this Tweet from Anne Jackson today, and it resonated with me a lot.

Learning to say no to good things. It’s always hard, but it’s necessary. I’ve been losing focus lately.

I know we all have lots of good things on our plate.

We have lots of great opportunities to get involved in lots of good things.

I think that the online world has not only opened the door for us to get involved in lots of good causes, but it has created a certain angst (how can I not get involved with so many good opportunities) that leaves us confused with whether or not to say no to all these opportunities.

So How Do You Know When To Say No To Good Things
Here are just 10 suggestions, or rather avenues and elements that help us think through the process.

  1. Prayer
  2. Small Group/Community Discernment
  3. Gifting/Skills
  4. Time
  5. Benefits
  6. Goals/Objectives/Focus
  7. Calling/Career Path
  8. Relationships (Family, spouse, kids, etc.)
  9. Self Care/Health
  10. Passion

How I Am Trying To Say No
Most often I don’t, which is a major flaw of mine that I’m working on.  There are lots of criteria that are a part of my thought process, but here are a few of mine.

  1. Time with Family.  This is my single most important criteria. If what I take on, takes away from time with my family, then I say no.  If I really want to do it, then I need to find something else to say no to that allows me to do it without taking more time away from my family.  I see more and more people sacrifice family life, marriages, time with children because they simply have too much on their plate, don’t have proper boundaries, or just can’t say no.


  2. Passion.  I have to be pretty passionate about something these days to say yes to it.  If I’m not passionate, and don’t see me being able to put the time, energy and effort into it that is required, then I usually will say no.


  3. Self Care. If we do not take care of ourselves, then we can not adequately do the things we have to do.  If my body is run down all the time, and if I don’t exercise, or eat right, or get enough rest, then other things begin to suffer.


  4. Spiritual Discernment.  I think we would all like to say that discernment from the Holy Spirit is what helps us make the right decisions…and I think that is true.  But that’s what makes saying no to good things so hard…so tricky.  We wrestle with whether or not the opportunity is of God for us to pursue, or of God for us to say no to. Calling and vocation all get wrapped up in this part.

I’m curious. How do you say no to good things? What good thing(s) have you recently said no to? What was your thought process?

Tired of the First Question from People, Pastors and Leaders Being “How Many People Were There?”

July 7, 2008 in Ministry-Theology with 5 Comments

It was not uncommon during my years in ministry to be asked how many students were at the college worship service during the week. I’m okay with that question per se, but why is that always the first question, and why are numbers the measuring stick for successful ministry?

We are always looking for some standard or metric to determine ministry success, but why numbers?

It would have been nice to be asked, “Hey, how were the students last night?” Or, “Tell me a story about a student?” Etc.

Eventually (but hopefully not for you) if you are in ministry long enough there will be the push for numbers in ministry, and that will be how your success is often determined. Then begins the vicious cycle. Do whatever you can to maintain and raise numbers, often forgetting what ministry is about, or who we are supposed to be following…Jesus.

And that’s just really sad I think. As my good friend RO Smith has said to me, “If we measure our success in ministry based on Jesus’ ministry, then we have 12 people following us, and one of them is trying to kill us.”

How’s that for success?

That’s why I love the following post.

Anne Jackson is so right on in her post The Competition-Driven Church.

Society today is competitive. We feel that our voices must be the loudest and carry the furthest in order to be heard and validated. It breaks my heart when I hear pastors of small churches say, “we only had seventy-five people today” or “only two hundred people showed up.”

Only? I’m sorry. Are those seventy-five or two hundred people not enough for you?

I am not going go into length discussing the perceived importance of numbers. Keeping track of “how many” is a valid metric to measure some kinds of effectiveness in what we are doing. Numbers do represent people. Christ did say that he would grow his Church.

However, our view is so limited as far as what that actually looks like in our church today.

Showing Skin Continued…

May 8, 2008 in Marriage-Family with 14 Comments

I just want to acknowledge that there were and are many angles that I could have gone yesterday in my post Showing Skin at Church.

I knew this going into the post, writing the post, and at the conclusion. And it was even more evident when I received lots of feedback from a lot of you, most of it not in the comment section, but via email, Facebook chat, etc. All good thoughts.

I could have addressed the issue of men more, and the responsibility they have in this issue.

I could have gone deeper on the issue of why modesty is important.

I could have talked about the disposition of our hearts, and how that can be a guide to what modesty looks like in our lives.

I could have tried to offer guidelines. That gets messy quickly.

I could have talked about the nuances of dress, and how what might be modest in some cultures, is or isn’t in others.

So you see…lots of angles, lots of positions…lots of places to go.

And though none of my commenters or friends talked to me about this, I do want to be clear about something: This is not just an issue that we are to put on women, or blame them. That would be like Adam blaming Eve for eating the apple, taking no responsibility for himself. There is a vicious cycle at work here, and I think we all contribute to it to some degree. So the best thing we can do is to come together as communities and be open and honest about it, and the struggles that proceed. And we can be of encouragement to each other.

My friend Wess has a great post where he delves deeper into the heart of the issue: On Immodesty: Too Much Skin (At Church and Elsewhere)?

Also, I’m sure Anne Jackson could have taken her post in many different directions as well, but was speaking out of her heart based on certain circumstances, etc. She continues to raise great questions in her writings.

When we think of the issue of modesty, or showing skin, in church or elsewhere….What are some angles or points of discussion that you would like to see raised?

As a woman, do you feel like the Church blames you, or puts the focus on you most of the time for this issue?

Or what questions do you have in your mind that you would like to see answered or at least wrestled with? One friend was asking me if there are appropriate times, places and contexts for women to dress sexy? So you see, there are a million rabbit trails we can go down, and I’m no expert. So let me hear from all of you.

Showing Skin at Church

May 7, 2008 in Marriage-Family with 13 Comments

I don’t know if this is an issue (too much skin) at your church, but it definitely is one at ours. I can’t tell you how many conversations there have been about this topic. Doesn’t matter how many times our pastor has talked about dress and modesty, it only seems to get worse.

And I don’t want to pick on women here, it’s just that men don’t usually show skin because women aren’t usually visually stimulated the same way men are.

But it’s definitely an issue and I’ve become more and more shocked by what young women are wearing, not only in church, but when I step out the door and head into public. I’ve thought on this issue before, but now that I have a baby daughter I’m thinking more about the issue of modesty and what my wife and I want to teach her as she grows up.

No matter what we as parents do I know there will always be that cultural peer pressure on my daughter to do something different. But in the midst of that pressure I hope that we can convey the message of the importance of modesty, and that showing skin is not what she should value or want approval from others for. Doesn’t get easier for parents when teen stars provide much of the cultural peer pressure (i.e. Hannah Montana).

And I know this is a difficult issue for men. A little skin on a woman can send a man’s thought process hurling into outer space and in a direction farthest from purity. So on the one hand a man might get excited and tempted by it, but it’s also the same thing that can destroy him or make him make decisions that he would otherwise not make. That’s power.

It’s a vicious cycle. Women are admired in our culture for their sexuality, but we as Christians are also trying to send a different message that doesn’t usually succeed.

I don’t know where we head on this issue in Church. But maybe it needs to be an open conversation between men and women where we can encourage each other to strive for lives of more modesty, rather than just blaming each other.

How powerful is “skin.” So powerful that I decided a couple of weeks ago that I needed to sign up for online accountability with Covenant Eyes. What does that mean? It means for $7 a month all of my online behavior is monitored and flagged where necessary. And then each week my wife, my brother, and two of my best friends get a report of what I was looking at during my online time during the week. I spend a lot of time on the internet, and I’m smart enough to know the power of sexuality, skin, porn and more online. It doesn’t matter that I’m a father, husband, friend or pastor. We are all susceptible to its temptations. I’ve heard people complain about paying for online monitoring, but come on…are you kidding me? This type of accountability is worth what it would cost two lattes at Starbucks.

I want to leave you with this latest post from Anne Jackson, my thoughts on boobies. Definitely a catching and controversial title. Anne is a pastor at LifeChurch.tv, and is the author of the book Mad Church Disease: The Church-Wide Burnout Epidemic. Check out her post at Relevant Magazine, Dirty Girls, The New Porn Addicts, as she talks about her struggle with pornography and the effects of it on her relationship.

Here is her entire post:

my thoughts on boobies
Written by Anne Jackson on May 7, 2008 – 12:32 pm

did you know?

–there is a female feature we call breasts. they can also be referred to as “boobies,” or “the twins,” or “the rack,” or “jugs,” so on, so forth.

–most men find this particular feature interesting. tempting. and amazing.

–upon catching a glimpse of said feature (regardless of how much is actually exposed), it is likely for a man’s mind to go to places it shouldn’t.

–with above knowledge, women, you now are educated and have no excuse.

–PLEASE USE WISDOM WHEN YOU DRESS YOURSELF.

aside: call me a prude. call me whatever. i don’t really care. and as much as this may seem like “casting judgment” (said in a very, scary, echo-y loud voice) on members of the female gender, please get a freaking clue.

i was doing some bloggy-clicking-around during my lunch and it amazes me how many “nice christian girls” (some who are even in church leadership – gasp!) show quite a bit of skin. in the office, at church parties, whatever (oh, and then post them ALL OVER THE INTERNET!)

please forgive me if it seems i have something stuck, as they say, where the sun don’t shine.

I DO.

it’s called modesty.

and if you are supposed to be living examples of godly women…you should too!

that is all.

sermon over.

please, carry on.

Think on this for a while…

April 17, 2008 in Ministry-Theology with 3 Comments

churches that rob each other??
Written by Anne Jackson on April 17, 2008 – 12:57 pm

ever since returning from africa, i’ve wondered something.

is it just me, or does THE CHURCH seem to have its funds distributed fairly unequally?

if we are all THE CHURCH (made up of individual, local churches)

and, if we are shown an example in acts 2:44-45:

All the believers were together and had everything in common. Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need.

then why:

is there a hard working children’s pastor making $75/week and who gets his office furniture from the side of the road because his church can’t afford to buy him any?

are churches closing because they don’t have enough money to sustain ministry?

edit: and i won’t even go into listing things that are broken in churches around the globe and in impoverished countries.

when:

other churches are building multi-million dollar facilities…in the same town, on the same road, right across the street from each other?

…i could make this list longer, but i am sure you get the point.

like really.

why?

churches that rob each other??

Complicated question, no easy answer. I just know that there is sort of a Walmart/megachurch effect, in that those with the most resources, and the most money, tend to dry up any resources that other, smaller churches may have. I’m not down on Walmart or megachurches. It is 27 miles from my house to my church where I worship and work. I have wondered what would happen if everyone went to the local church in their community and gave of their resources (i.e. money, time, service, gifts, etc.). But instead, most of us drive clear across town to attend the cool church, or to find a ministry that meets our needs. In the process that church ends up sucking up all the resources…and most often, unintentionally.
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